No stopping it now ...
 

Who's to say the volcano is going to stop any time soon? It could keep erupting on and off for weeks, months or even years. Methinks someone had better come up with plan B real soon!

Is it feasible to increase FLs to go over the volcanic ash cloud or does it go above FL400? Or does even a short ascent and descent through the cloud result in flameout or engine and windscreen damage??

Hi Philip

I think the ash has risen to at least 20,000 metres and a report I heard on the radio yesterday mentioned that the last time the volcano erupted (in the 19th century) it spewed ash intermittently for two years.

And a report in "The West Australian" today had an interview with a couple who were aboard the BA flight which flew through volcanic ash near Indonesia in 1982 on its way from Kuala Lumpur to Perth. All four engines stopped and the pilot had to put the B747 into a steep dive to restart the engines.

Thankfully they did and the aircraft landed safely in Jakarta.

Apparently the aircraft was only in the volcanic cloud for a short time so by the sounds of things you just don't go anywhere near them.

Land safely it did - this is despite the windscreen being opaque thanks to effectively being sandblasted and similarly the landing lights were badly impacted. They could not even taxi off the runway by themselves, had to get a tow.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/British_Airways_Flight_9

The captain of that flight is still around to talk to the media today, which of course he has been doing.

http://news.google.com/news/search?q=Eric+Moody

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/8623210.stm
http://edition.cnn.com/2010/TRAVEL/0....story/?hpt=C2

UK Met Office Volcanic Ash Advisory Centre
http://metoffice.com/aviation/vaac/index.html

Issued Graphics:
http://metoffice.com/aviation/vaac/vaacuk_vag.html

See also - Icelandic Met Office
http://en.vedur.is/

Eruption Flyby:
http://en.vedur.is/about-imo/news/2010/nr/1877

Speaking to a friend in Southern Portugal, they are receiving some extra flights into Faro and Lisbon (mainly charter) as they are well south of the ash cloud. People are then able catch trains into Spain and France. Spain, Portugal and Southern France may well be viable ports into Europe if this continues for some time - just means flying over Africa and not through Europe.

I did see a report on sky news that suggested areas like Russia, Japan and even northern USA and Canada may be affected by the cloud as it moves around the globe in coming days/weeks.

If it does behave like it did in 1820, maybe ocean liners will make a return at least on the atlantic runs? :D

This is from the Eurocontrol web site.

The current Met Office predictions appear to suggest all of France will be out. Looks more to be like just Spain, Portugal and perhaps Rome at the moment. Of course the infrastructure (airports, ground transport) will limit how much you can get out of this.

I wonder how badly BA is going to be hit by all of this - will also be interesting to see where this leaves the cabin crew dispute.

And it now looks like SQ378 may be operating direct to Barcelona - the Flight Status has now eliminated Milan and has it arriving in Barcelona an hour ahead of the Scheduled time.

Assuming there is a crew to operate SQ377, it will be interesting to see whether they delay it until Milan is open again, or do the return direct as well. Direct would probably be good for the passengers too - no doubt lots of empty seats with no Milan stop.

Edit at 15:30 - have to love the live flight tracking as http://www.flightradar24.com/ shows SQ378 at FL370 just west of Corsica now.

Thanks for the tip Nigel, but I reckon Heathrow (and Gatwick) would be more appealing at present!!

Have a thought if one of the Indonesian volcanoes was to let go in the near future ... how would that affect Australian Airspace? Would we see the same mass shutdown as Europe?:eek:

Hi there

Ryanair have cancelled 1,162 flights for saturday 17/04, they are allowing rebooking at no extra charge.

Is it Mick's birthday or Irish new year, because Ryanair would normally say tough ****, not our problem. :p

Anthony T

Anyone who has doubts about the effect of volcanic ash on aircraft engines should read this ... looks like they closed the airspace in time.

http://www.flightglobal.com/articles...-volcanic.html

And this could just be the beginning of years of disruption .....

http://www.newscientist.com/article/...fireworks.html

And SQ377 from Barcelona has now been cancelled (SQ378 made it in) - SMS message from my friend, they checked in at around 0800 for a scheduled 1025 departure, told to return at 0930 for an update, which was then to return at 1130 for a further update at which the advice was cancelled until tomorrow. SQ is putting them up in Hotels for the night.

I stand to be corrected but I believe there is neglible cross-equatorial wind flow, and the proverbial doldrums prevail in countries that straddle the equator like Indonesia. On that basis I don't think Australian airspace would be affected in the way that Europe has been blanketed by the Icelandic volcanic ash.

Philip, I'm not sure about the cross-equatorial wind flow, but I do remember when Mt Pinatubo in the Philippines blew back in the late 80's (from memory) and at that time I lived in Perth. We had the most amazing sunsets over the Indian Ocean from the volcanic ash and dust generated from the eruption.

Hmm ...
 

As I understand things, Lee, volcanic dust from the Philippines could not affect a Perth sunset, so I'd love to know how that phenomenon came about.

I had a call from my friend in Barcelona late last night, who told me the story of SQ378/377.

Apparently the crews normally change in Milan in both diretions, so with SQ378 having overflown Milan, there was of course no crew in Barcelona - and of course no prospect of flying the crew stranded in Milan (or aywhere else for that matter) in.

So, the crew get 24 hours to rest in Barcelona and at 0950 local time on Sunday, SQ377 departs direct to Singapore. The initial routing might be interesting due to Airspace closures.

Meanwhile, SQ has supplied all the non local passengers with accommodation in a 4 Star Hotel in the Montjuic area, all hotel meals and 10 minutes of International Phone calls. Well done SQ.

I remember when one of the Indonesian Volcano's went off in the late 80's or early 90's we had great sunsets in Melbourne!
So there must be a reason!

However, it did affect those in Manila, I was stuck there for a week. Life was hard in those days :D

This song is probably appropriate right now...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EvuL5jyCHOw

Hi there

There are still a few flights in the UK, the Isle of Wight hovercraft is still operating. :D

This is an inaugrual flight I am happy to miss. :-)

Anthony T

Barcelona now closed
 

Now its Spain's turn - airports in Northern Spain have now been closed until 16:00 local time Sunday.

SQ377 passengers were about to board when the news was communicated.

better not play this song at the airport!

Test Flights
 

Interesting,

All credit to BA & Virgin on this one. They have been very quick to cancel flights the day before. Ie both have already cancelled all flights tomorrow.

In contrast, KLM seem to be more optimistic... they only now just cancelled this evenings flights... They also ask people NOTto turn up at the airport, but what do you do if your flight is at 7pm and at 6pm it still shows as flying!!!

British Airways have sent up a 747-400 test flight over the uk leaving Heathrow just after 18.00 local. Understand a certain Mr Willy Walsh was on board. Aircraft used was G-CIVC and is due to land in Cardiff for engineers to inspect the engines after the 90 minute flight.
The two Qantas 747's at Heathrow since Thursday morning are VH-OJG and OJS.

Have just arrived back in the UK from Amsterdam. Was due to leave on Thursday, so only 3 days late. Came back on a ferry, which I booked Friday morning. All the ferries from Amsterdam are booked until Wednesday at the earliest. Quite a pleasant day to sail actually!

Interesting you mention BA, something I found a tad odd was when my first flight was canceled I received an SMS, I then had the option to rebook the flight. However the 2nd flight never actually showed up as being canceled despite the fact that it clearly was canceled. So if I had just used my booking as a guide I would have assumed it was actually flying.

what would the airlines do with their planes while they are stuck on the ground?

Hi Joseph,

Some photos have popped up on airliners.net of the aircraft sitting on the ground and from what i could see in them aircraft have been moved to stand off areas and engine covers have been put on.

Some other board members may have some more detailed info on this

thanks dan, i too have seen those images.
i mainly referring to weather or not the airlines will insure their planes will be in tip top shape mechanically and in appearance?

At 16+ years, that isn't the oldest in the fleet by any chance? You know, if they had to write it off... :confused:

EDIT: Nope... scrub that, according to http://www.airfleets.net/flottecie/B...ctive-b747.htm, their active 744 fleet is between and 11 and 20 years old. :rolleyes:

Regarding Compensation.

Under EU law (regulation 261) all EU carriers are required to provide hotels and 3 meals a day to any passenger delayed. There is no 'act of God' clause in the legislation and therefore it is hotly disputed by airlines.

An example provided this morning by the CEO of Monarch Airlines (UK charter company. On a GBP60 fare Monarch to Spain, Monarch is liable for ~GBP250/day in expenses on top of normal airlines costs. Multiply this by thousands of pax and costs blow out massively.

Apparently applies to :
.. non-EU carriers for pax inside the EU.
.. EU carriers wherever the pax are

Not applicable to non-EU carriers for pax outside the EU travelling to the EU.

Check Wiki and Mt Pinatubo http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mount_Pinatubo Pictures are there apparently taken over South America by NASA showing some of the effects.

This might seem like a bit of a stupid question. Does anyone know if Virgin Atlantic are just flying Sydney - Hong Kong at the moment? It has said every day that the flight has departed.. Just a tad confused, since BA have both of their birds parked here in Sydney, and i haven't had a chance in the last few days to pop by and see if VS was there too..

Hi Kieran,

The following is from the VS website:

And the twice delayed SQ377 finally departed Barcelona at 0320 local on Monday, arriving in Singapore at 2127 local.

As to compensation mentioned above, the passengers didnt have to spend a cent from the time of initial check in at Barcelona on Saturday morning. SQ found and paid for Hotels, all meals, telephone calls, transport to and from. Must have cost the Airline a packet...and thats just one flight.

Seems these passengers were lucky, they actually got out and were well looked after by SQ.

Stranded German tourists interviewed on local Las Vegas news here last night who have bookings with BA stated they were receiving accommodation and meals and their level of treatment from the airline was much higher than their expectations. Must be thanks to this EU law mentioned by Matt D.

Scottish airspace is due to open from 0700Local Tuesday followed by more UK and european airspace during the day as the forcast shows the ash moving away. Also the volcano has been far more stable during the last 24 hours with eruptions far less violent. British Airways are planning to operate as many long haul departures leaving Heathrow after 1600 as possible, and selected short hauls from 1800.
Virgin are also expecting to operate some of there long hauls out of Heathrow Tuesday night.
British Airways are planning operating some inbounds to Heathrow including the Tuesday afternoon departures from Sydney and the displaced aircraft in Asian ports. Wonder if Qantas will operate OJG and OJS back tomorrow night?

Just had a few flights leave AMS with pax onboard going to DXB, PVG and JFK.

Thanks Dan,I must admit i did have a quick look at the VS website, but didn't see anything. It jus had a whole lot of *'s next to certain flights(and the SYD-HKG) was one..

The BA flight from LAS-LHR (stranded in LAS from Apr-14 local) is now back at the gate and is scheduled for departure at 1.40am early Tuesday morning Apr-20 (late Monday night Apr-19) Las Vegas time. This is operating as the usual BA274 flight for Monday with scheduled departure time of 8.40pm, but no doubt pushed back to 1.40am due to backlog and/or air space reopening timing factors.