So... Who is next?
Airlines going out of business has become as familiar as the change of weather lately.
Any tips on who you think might be next to go? |
Alitalia...
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Agree - they may have a little under 2 weeks left, with them apparently losing $1.6millionUSD per day i read earlier today... |
Freedom Air...
oops..no..already gone. :) |
Bye Bye Jetstar Asia
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I suppose it really comes down to what airlines have huge debts and cant refinance them int he current tight credit environment.... With this, id say the airlines in EU / USA are more exposed due to the down turn and hieghtened competiiton. Airlines in our part of the world are still making some decent profits
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Well the Air France / KLM takeover of Alitalia has failed so I suppose that might see them go next!
It's a real shame too, Alitalia was an icon back in the 70s and 80s. |
Italy govt appeals to Alitalia unions over Air France
Italisn Government has started to push the point with the aviation industry. Although there are numerous other carriers in Italy, Alitalia is arguable the figurehead of their airline industry, hence they would not want to see them go.
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In My opinion in Australia
Tiger - Unsustainable Low Fares. Backed by Singapore Air, If it doesn't work or make money the pin could easily be pulled. Fighting for Terminal space and affordable airport costs.. A little rocky at the moment JetStar - Low Cost slightly higher than tiger. Backed by Qantas (QF can offload flights & destinations etc to JQ. Also no great issue with airport space, just share/piggy back with QF) Virgin Blue - To me they seem a little lost... They are heading away from LCC more so to the Qantas end... They have ridiculous running costs and have just purchased less efficient aircraft the E-Jets, carrying less passengers... Kind of the old Ansett CRJ move.. Risky in 'my opinion' Qantas - I hope that they keep pushing the fleet renewal, some of the QF jets are looking rather tacky and old. As far as maintenance issues, I think the media have blown it way out of proportion. So basically 'in my opinion' I see in Australia Tiger is the most likely to depart, but I also am concerned for DJ... I mean toll are trying to sell it and even Branson doesn't want it back... He is very smart with his $$. High Costs.. They "Virgin" are sitting where Ansett was, the meat in the sandwich.. DJ > AN > QF whereas today its like TT,JQ > DJ > QF.. 'which way do Virgin go?' they are heading QF's Way, and QF is slooowly ditching services and giving to JQ.... What does everyone else think? |
I really agree with Tiger leaving over the next finacial year, if no profit is made. Tiger should have come 4 years ago, and it would have been king. Jetstar are flying high, but Virgin is the one to watch with the regional move and premium economy focus.
I must say Tiger is the one to go next:(, those Unsustainable Low Fares are just stupid, I wont be booking to far ahead with Tiger |
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The trade unions have forced the knockback of the AF/KLM offer which was really the best chance Alitalia had. |
So Trade Unions forced the knockback of the AF/KLM deal, so rather than all those Alitalia staff keeping their jobs it all goes ***** up coz of a Union.
Sorry but I have never been a fan of unions. |
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Martin,
"Im the same more trouble than they are worth." What do you mean the union is more trouble than it is worth? Nick, How much do you know about "the unions"? |
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I didn't ask you to repeat what you said Martin, I asked you what you meant by your comment...
Or are you going to fein ignorance and dodge the question again? |
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Ive also seen where the union has been that weak that they wouldnt even seek a EBA from the company and just excepted award wages for its members, I used to question the union rep and say well Ive given the union $7 in union dues all year but what have you done for the members and what are we going to see in the future? It was a weak response of well nothing much and I have never been a union member ever again and wont ever be either as they are more than happy to take the dues from you and offer nothing in return, I guess another prime example would be the QF pay/EBA discussions recently the union came out all gun ho saying well rolling stoppages etc and as soon as it come time to do it the union had already gone as soft as butter, and in the end I dont think they did anything. |
Grant, as an owner driver for many years with TNT and basically being "forced" to join a union just to be treated as a human being and the countless days I went unpaid due to petty disputes between the union and the company due to strike action which was battled out in the IRC I have had enough of unions to last me a lifetime.
I will admit I was raised by parents who were strongly Liberal Party advocates and who were strongly anti-union. My grandfather was also foreman on the docks for 40 years and some of the union crap they used to carry on with was rather astonishing. I understand alot of people here are in employment within the airline industry which I believe is still heavily unionised? |
We have the answer.
OASIS HONG KONG are apparently terminating all services 4PM Hong Kong time today.:( Brad |
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Dummy booking shows no availability. They looked like such an awesome carrier! I just read about them in March Aus. Aviation too...i was really looking forward to them coming into the Australian market. |
Hong Kong budget airline Oasis in liquidation
Hong Kong budget airline Oasis in liquidation
http://afp.google.com/article/ALeqM5...KRT4Wo6xlH6wSA Quote:
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I would never have bought the Jungle Jet....bad move.
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It is amusing that Oasis are still advertising their student bundle airfares to London! Most other airlines remove all advertising when they go down...
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Wholey smokes... they're dropping like flies! :eek:
With increasing fuel-prices now here to stay, looks like the industry is beginning a 'shake out' phase. Survival of the fittest for those carriers who haven't got strong financial backing. Sad to see Oasis go..they had a great livery and seemed very promising. Another one bites the dust I guess...:( |
Who is next I wonder?
My guess would be Viva Macau |
I don't know alot about Viva Macau but they seem to have a good marketing strategy and the destination is great. I suppose either another Asian or American airline may be next.
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Frontier. Watch this space!
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Didn't some airline in the US called Champion Air go under the other day?
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AirAsia is the only strong one in the region |
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Tiger likewise is owned by SQ (49%), both have strong financial support, |
Yes, dont forget about the other 51% of investors. If they are not pulling in any cash soon, then they will just pull the plug:p No point digging deeper of investors pockets if they get nothing in return
JQ Asia,TT would be bad investments to get into, both have lost hundreds of Millions over the past 4 years:eek:. Anyway they could always impove, its just going to take a while thats all |
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Frontier have just filed fro Chapter 11 Bankruptcy protection.
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Are you in the financial game? Or a numbers man? Please provide said evidence to backup your claims that 3K and TR have lost "hundreds of millions" over the last four years... I would be interested to know... |
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This is starting to get out of hand. I guess when it rain.. it pours!! Looks like all those fascinating and colourful Frontier tales may not be around for too much longer. What do you guys think of Virgin America's viability (or should that be survivability) over the coming months to a year? |
From Jetphotos...
VRG suspends flights to international destinations VRG Linhas Aéreas S/A (Rio de Janeiro) is suspending flights to several international destinations, including Mexico City, Paris and Madrid, over the next two months in order to focus on better adapting to market conditions, while increasing its presence in the domestic and South American markets and concentrating efforts on routes where it maintains competitive advantages. The Company’s focus will be to expand its route network in Brazil and South America by maintaining a lean cost structure and increasing revenues. ---- is this the start of another one to start heading under?? "lean cost structure" sounds interesting, however for an airline to pull several international routes, there has to be something going on.... |
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-Tiger Airways have lost: $37.4m 2006 loss $14.3 2007 loss Tiger Airways is now due for a finance report(2007-2008 year) -Jetstar Asia have lost: $36 ValuAir Merger $47.5m 2006 loss $14m 2007 loss $36m 2007 investors money Jetstar Asia are swimming in debt, but not drowning. Looks like Tiger will report a small profit any day now, but still these airlines are in a grim situation and Virgin America have lost so far: $37m first quater:eek: Souces: http://www.straitstimes.com/Latest%2BNews/Money/STIStory_204193.html http://www.channelnewsasia.com/stori...269667/1/.html http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jetstar...ys#cite_note-1 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tiger_Airways http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/articl.../BUNFU05OQ.DTL |
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From Ikramerica: From how I understand it, they had to enter Ch.11 ASAP so that the CC (Credit Card) company could not change the terms of their deal. After reading up on "hold backs" and how they work, the CC Processor is within their right to change the terms if they see a fundamental change in the business they are working with. It's within the contract F9 (Frontier Airlines) has with them. They must be worried about F9's losses and that the mantra for ATA and AQ (Aloha Airlines) passengers has been "contact your credit card company" which is plastered all over the web as advice. I'm sure the credit card companies are ****ed they are being put in the middle, and the processors even more so (charge backs are expensive), and so are now increasing hold back on all "shaky" carriers to protect themselves. And from how I understand it, the processor could basically hold all F9s credit card transactions for a long period of time as security. But by filing Ch.11, that freezes all contracts and terms as is for a set amount of time (60 days?). At least that's how I understand it. Then the BK judge can sort through it. But it means everything holds as is, the CC processor can't increase the hold back, and F9 stays liquid. Probably. Link to thread Sounds like a plausible explanation for Frontier's sudden announcement. Seems like they're trying to think more about long-term viability and don't want to get caught out by this sudden squeeze that creditors have placed upon struggling airlines. |
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