Virgin Aust. pilot suing for $1m

[Dave Dale]

Originally Posted by chris d

That's the culture of the internet, where it is common for people to 'stir things up'.

To Owen and Chris and others like minded,

No I am not sitting here trying to stir things up. What a cop out!

No where have we read that this pilot has tried to influence risk management at Virgin to change this practice, no where have we read that the pilot has taken the matter to task with Virgin, or report it through some chain of command. Has any of this occurred? Has there been engagement of occupational health and safety? Was this a first resort approach to an end result? Virgin obviously had a system in place for flight charts which worked for many years that even themselves would have thought not to be too onerous on the pilot.

We only ever hear one side of the story and in this case, it was from documentation filed with the Supereme Court by the plaintiff. We have not heard the response from Virgin. I stand by my assertion that the pilot should harden up. I anticipate a very good response from Virgin in relation to this matter.

I do not know you, Owen and Chris, but to call me an ínternet stirrer', perhaps I should see you both sitting behind the said pilot, in the gallery of the Supreme Court with your placards, "Poor pilot, how could this have been?''

Dave

[Montague S]

Originally Posted by Andrew Johnson

What's he going to do sue me ? Good luck.

I used to carry more than that in my school bag everyday.

What a privolous case. Hope it gets thrown out before it starts.

I helped a mate with a back injury by lifting his 15kg TV, I was out of action for nearly 3 years...your reply is what's frivolous.

[Jakef]

Originally Posted by chris d

Does Virgin Australia allow electronic devices to be used during landing and takeoff? Their website wasn't very clear - it mention phones and transmitting devices with airplane mode.

If there are policies banning the use of electronic devices during landing or takeoff, then that sort of prevents the use of iPad as an electronic flight bag.

That's irrelevant, the iPad (In flight mode) isn't a transmitting device so it can safely be used, especially by the pilots when it's their choice to use them.

[matthew mcdonald]

I agree with Andrew from the point of veiw that, to get a job doing lifting of any sorts (baggage handler etc) you would have had to have a medical or at least basic training to teach you how to lift a bag of heavy weight the correct way. (Bending down and not using your back completely) In this case the bag wasn't the heaviest bag but it was of a weight that the captain should have adjusted to compensate for the weight. So I dont believe Andrew's post was wrong just wrongly worded.

[Owen H]

Pilots cannot just suddenly start using them - it would need to be approved by the company.

A pilot does not have a choice - if the company requires charts, and insists the pilot provide them, then he must do so. He cannot choose to mitigate this by the use of the iPad or similar device unless they are specifically approved.

The law suit may be frivolous... but it comes as a very big surprise to me that Virgin still insist pilots provide their own charts on the aircraft. Virgin are a major international carrier. That is the big surprise here to me. A back injury suffered by a pilot is no surprise at all.

[Kirk C]

Originally Posted by Jeremy W

Andrew I suggest you go fill a bag with 18kg's of something and try lugging it around an airport on your shoulder or back - it's not a light as it sounds! Even if it was a wheelie bag, lifting in and out of busses, into cupboards a few times a day could easily cause back problems.

I'd also suggest since this bloke is in the mood for a lawsuit, going onto a public forum and calling him a weakling probably isn't the smartest move.

Hi Jeremy, im 26 years old, and only weigh 70 KG's I dont have a lot of muscle, I dont consider my self strong, however for 2 years I carried two (some times four if there was a cycle change out over night) Jepperson bags on and off JQ A320s, using an Aerobridge Jacobs ladder, in and out of our Van, and up and down our office stairs, I never once sustained an injury nor did I ever think they were two heavy.

[Gareth Forwood]

To bring some law into this, rather than all the "harden up" comments, I have copied the following from the WorkCover (NSW) website:

A primary duty of care is owed by [an employer] when it:

• directs or influences work carried out by a worker
• engages or causes to engage a worker to carry out work (including through subcontracting)
• has management or control of a workplace.

The [employer] must meet its obligations, so far as is reasonably practicable, to provide a safe and healthy workplace for workers or other persons by ensuring:

• safe systems of work
• a safe work environment
• ...
• adequate information, training, instruction and supervision is given

Basically, this guy has a reasonable case if he can demonstrate that practicable and safer alternatives were available and that he wasn't provided adequate training. Now all the "harden up" people are going to say that you shouldn't need training for lifting a 16kg bag, but the lower back is generally not particularly strong and using the wrong lifting technique can cause damage. Now, if he was given training on the proper way to lift, then it may be more difficult to prove damages.

I would be honestly amazed if he never received any lifting guidance - in this day and age of lawsuits, almost every employer has a compulsory H&S induction, including lifting techniques. I'm an engineer and will likely never lift anything heavier than a pad of paper in my career, but I still had the training.

[Matt Coughran]

Originally Posted by Gareth Forwood

I'm an engineer and will likely never lift anything heavier than a pad of paper in my career, but I still had the training.

What do you mean? you don't even lift a pen to go with that pad of paper you bludger!

But Gareth is right, regarding if there is a legal case, But again I dont think there was many large forms of technology that supported electronic books back then, and from my knowledge not CASA approved.

[Mike Scott]

ust fyi..I'm currently out on 30 days disability after helping a older lady get her bag out of the overhead (so we working crew could get past to exit the aircraft ...f/a's were busy with other Pax. Bag must have been full of rocks (weighed a bunch) but i pulled it out the wrong way not expecting the weight and pulled a back muscle....and I have no history of back problems !!! Bottom line is that after filling in a proverbial bag full of paperwork (how why when where etc) and trying to explain how this was/is part of my job description (company say's not) I now have the union involved and now am in the middle of one big mess. Sue ??? Probably not since I'm confident in my union rep...but, interesting thought !!! Regardless of how many ipads/pods/or Iwhatevers they give me they will all go in my flight bag along with all my other crap....been carrying it for almost 40 years...not about to go without it now (for the time when all the other stuff fails...anyway..doing Jepps updates is therapeutic ....goes great with a beer or three...plan B is that it helps pass the time when commuting....and I dont have to recharge it !!!!

Aloha from HNL
MS