#31
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Phil,
Having an ILS out should not be a factor at all. If a pilot can't make a visual approach, then they've got some serious lack of flying ability issues. Mick |
#32
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What Happened to Asiana Airlines Flight 214?
Only conjecture based upon fairly limited data available, but still an interesting analysis nonetheless |
#33
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Asiana Airlines revealed the pilot in charge of landing the Boeing 777 that crash-landed at San Francisco's airport was training for the long-range plane and that it was his first flight to the airport with the jet
The pilot had 43 hours of experience of flying the 777, a spokesperson for the airline revealed. His co-pilot, Lee Jeong-Min had 3,200 hours of flying experience aboard a 777 and was in the cockpit with Kang-Kook when disaster struck. The crew tried to increase its speed and abort its landing just seconds before it hit the seawall in front of the airport runway Recordings show crew had no concerns before landing then tried to 'go around' 1.5 seconds before impact The airport's Glide Path system, which is designed to avoid runway misses in a variety of weather, was switched off |
#34
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The give a little balance to the "43 hours at the controls of a B777" story.
From Air Transport World ... Quote:
__________________
Joined 1999 @www16Right FlightDiary Airliners Web QR Retired PPL C150/172 PA28-161/181 Pitts S-2B SIM: 12Hr QF B767 B744 CX B742 Nikon D100-D200-D300-D500 |
#35
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Here's another interesting read from a First Officer' view: http://www.curacaochronicle.com/avia...77-approached/
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#36
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http://www.ntsb.gov/investigations/2...asiana214.html
all the updated info from probably the most reliable source. |
#37
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Business as usual
Good evening,
Sorry to send my message very late, so look at a picture of stricken Asiana Ailines with other Asiana Airlines B777 landing behind it on page 13 in today's SMH newspaper. Regards, Cliff Cook. |
#38
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Speculation
With all of the caveats that have to go with sparse information, this extract from the commentary cited by Mike at http://www.yssyforum.net/board/showp...9&postcount=32 seems to me the most plausible primary cause of the crash:
Quote:
__________________
Philip Last edited by Philip Argy; 11th July 2013 at 06:19 PM. |
#39
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Phil,
You're close regarding FLCH but more information is needed. Flight Level Change is a function of speed (really has nothing to do with the fact that the glideslope was inoperative). Which means that the pitch of the aircraft is changed to reach that targeted speed. Using FLCH on descent the autothrottle operates in THR (Thrust) to maintain the descent rate required by the pitch mode. Once the thrust setting is achieved the mode changes to HOLD (thrust lever autothrottle servos are inhibited and the pilot can set thrust levers manually) this is why in FLCH or TOGA (which I wont go into now) the autothrottles don't 'wake up' as you put it. Now to use FLCH for a descent a lower altitude must be set. I'm not sure what the crew set as an altitude but once the selected altitude is reached the autothrottle mode will change from HOLD to SPD (Speed - the autothrottle system is now commanding thrust to achieve the required speed) and normal system protection is restored. If they set an altitude of 0' then HOLD would still have been the current mode as they hadn't reached the selected altitude yet. Unfortunately FLCH and TOGA below 100' RA (Radio Altitude) on approach the autothrottle will not automatically activate the stall protection. For this reason Boeing do not recommend the use of FLCH for approaches past the final approach fix. Even if the glideslope is inoperative the aircraft is still capable of many of the other non precision approaches available at SFO, and with the appropriate pitch mode (V/S - vertical speed, FPA - Flight Path Angle, or VNAV - Vertical Navigation) the stall protection would have been activated. So yes the 'FLCH trap' did catch them out but I believe it was more a case of misunderstanding the use of certain autopilot system controls as the aircraft performed exactly as it was meant to. Of course we will wait for the official report on the accident on what modes the crew were operating in, but I hope I provided a more educated post on the use of FLCH rather than a simplified 'easy way to recover is to set a lower altitude, use speedbrake etc' answer as what was quoted in your post. |
#40
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On the money
The NTSB will give us all the gory detail probably in about a year but I reckon with the talent on this board we have nailed it 99% well enough to be confident in expressing a view about WHAT most likely happened as distinct from WHY that happened or was allowed to happen.
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Philip |
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