Air France 447

[Andrew P]

as is airline practice after a major incident, Air France will cease using the flight number AF447, AF445 will now be used for that route

Banjo

[Jason H]

Funny though that Aeroflot still use 593 on the same route that one of their A310s came down on years ago. Youd think they'd want to forget about that embrassment as much as they could

[Gerard M]

Now it seems they are saying the oil slick and the debris are not from the Air France flight. So the mystery thickens.

http://www.smh.com.au/world/sea-tras...0605-bxsg.html

[Tony P]

Originally Posted by chris d

The other talk is of turbulence, and of the plane stalling at 35,000ft.

Sounds like Coffin Corner.

Here's the ACARS:


Taken from here:
http://jt.france2.fr/20h/

[Montague S]

any bus drivers able to interpret the above?

[Troy R.]

According to the NZ Herald the Brazilian Navy has recovered the first piece of wreckage. Apparently it is a 2.5m long structural member.

[Rhys Xanthis]

From Reuters;

Searchers have found several debris sites spread out over 90 km (56 miles), a sign the plane may have broken up in the air. Cardoso said they have yet to collect any debris from the Airbus.

[Hugh Jarse]

Some that I recognise (not being an Airbus pilot)

Control Rudder Travel Limit Fault
Flag on FO's Primary Flight Display (PFD)
" " Capt's " " "
TCAS Fault
Flight Autothrottle Off
PFD Flags again....
Flight Control Alternate Law
Something to do with Auto FLight
Autopilot Off
.
.
.
Control Secondary 1 Fault
Control Primary 1 Fault
(Possible) IRU1 and 3 FAIL?
More PFD Flags
EFCS Electronic Flight Control System(????) FAIL

FLR=FAIL
WRN=Warning

One thing's for sure - there was a lot happening.......

[Philip Argy]

I don't know if lightning could be responsible for whatever led to these messages, but it does raise a concern about the increased number of avionics incidents in recent years.

I think the testing of increasingly sophisticated avionics needs to be a whole lot more rigorous, especially where fly by wire leaves little in the way of alternative flight control means.

Here's someone else's views on the avionics. I don't vouch for them but do share many of them:
http://www.project7alpha.com/2009/06/france-447-facts/

[Trevor Sinclair]

I hate to speculate and add to any confusion. I have not read every post on this topic, however, this is something I received from a friend today.

There is some information getting out about the mechanical failures that were automatically transmitted to the company by the aircraft ACARS systems (a continuously operating communication system that is sending messages). Every malfunction of the plane is automatically transmitted to the company at the same time the pilots get the warning.

Here is the time line that I have found along with the failures. All time is GMT or Zulu time. For East coast people that means subtract 4 hours to come up with East coast time.

1. 0210Z Autopilot failure. This would be 2210 or 1010PM east coast time.

The pilot is now hand flying the plane in possibly severe turbulence due to the storms.

2. 0211Z ADIRU failure (air data inertial reference unit) The pilots primary attitude, airspeed, and altitude displays are starting to fail. There are backups and I don't know how much has failed.

3. 0213Z SEC 1 Fault, Alternate flight control laws: This is one of the computers amongst several the pilot uses to control the elevator and spoilers (the roll axis). He still has backups, but now the computer systems for flight controls are degraded and the pilot has to be careful not to lose control in the turbulence. The flight control has degraded to what we call alternate law. Time to concentrate on some good hand flying at night in turbulence.

4. NAV warnings and Flight control warnings: Nav warnings are the least of his concerns at this point and I still don't know what he had left for flight instruments, but he has lost some and maybe most primary flight instruments. It's time to ignore warnings and failures and just concentrate on what is working. Maintain control of the plane, wings level, proper pitch attitude and power settings until we get through the turbulence.

5. Last ACARS message at 0214Z 35,000 feet, failure of cabin altitude, electrical problems, pressurization problems. The pilot was unable to safely hand fly the plane. I don't know why. The airplane is breaking up. The pilot has lost control.

Notice that 4 minutes have elapsed since the autopilot failure. At 0214z the multiple warnings and the pressurization problem make me wonder if the pilots were unable to keep the airplane under control, overstressed it at high altitude, high airspeed, in severe turbulence and the overstressed airframe came apart. The pressurization warning may mean the fuselage has broken open and this last transmission indicates that after 0214Z no electrical systems were working because the plane is coming apart as it falls out of the sky and the structural integrity of the wings, fuselage etc. is destroyed.

The wreckage for Air France will be scattered over a very wide area if this is true: i.e., at least several miles as seat cushions are falling from the sky starting at 35,000 feet.

This analysis of Air France 447 is based on what appears to be pretty specific information that is being reported on the web.